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[Source: YouTube/MichaelKnowles]
One holy Catholic and Apostolic, the Church is unified. If a church does not have marks of unity, that would raise some questions according to the Creed.
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Brother Bob Pellien: Dear friends, there are many preachers who speak of and teach about being the true church. And here in this podcast, this gentleman spoke of the marks of the true church, and he made mention of the Catholic Church and his perceptions of the marks that would identify the true church. You know, he speaks about the Catholic church being that one true church we should say, we should start off, dear friends right off the bat, by saying that the Bible does teach about only one true church. So we pose, which is it? How can we identify it? And is it really important to know all about it? These are what we’ll be discussing today right here on the Iglesia Ni Cristo International Edition.
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INC International Edition
Brother Bob Pellien: Dear friends, there are three main identifiers in the Holy Scriptures that identify the true Church, and we’re going to be addressing them in the upcoming series.
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Today’s topic: IS THE NAME OF THE RELIGION IMPORTANT?
(THE TRUE CHURCH: PART 1)
Brother Bob Pellien: The first and for today, True church has an identifiable name. Then in part two, in this series, we’ll be addressing how the true church is prophesied. Then in part three, we will address the true church that knows who the true God is.
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Bob Pellien
San Francisco, California
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Bob Pellien: I’m Bob Pellien, and that’s what we’ll be discussing here today on the Iglesia Ni Cristo International Edition. And joining us today in this important discussion is Brother Eric Waterman in Quezon City, Philippines. Welcome to the program, Brother Eric.
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Eric Waterman
Quezon City, Philippines
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Eric Waterman: Thank you, Brother Bob, for inviting me to be part of the panel discussion today.
Brother Bob Pellien: Joining us is well from the United Kingdom in the City of London, Brother Rommel San Pedro. Brother Rommel, thanks for being up late and joining with us in our discussion for today.
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Rommel San Pedro
London, United Kingdom
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Rommel San Pedro: Brother Bob, I’m glad to be part of this program, and I’d like to welcome all of our viewers.
Brother Bob Pellien: And as well we have with us today, Brother Julius Malabanan from the island of Saipan in Micronesia. Brother Julius, thanks for being with us.
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Julius Malabanan
Saipan, Northern Marianas
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Julius Malabanan: Hafaday! Brother Bob. Greetings to my fellow Brothers and greetings to all the viewers.
Brother Bob Pellien: Hafaday. It’s nice. I still remember that greeting in Saipan. That’s how they greet one another there. Hello, even goodbye, etc. It’s kind of like the Hawaiian Aloha. Is it not Brother Julius?
Brother Julius Malabanan: Yes, it is, Brother.
Brother Bob Pellien: Brothers, although there are, as we’ve mentioned, many identifying traits of the true church that our Lord Jesus Christ Himself established, and they’re taught here in the Bible, its name is certainly one of those identifying traits. Many believe, however, that the name of the church, that’s not what’s important. So they make up so many different names. And we’ve looked at many of those names in another episode of this program in the past, and that episode was entitled, “Does the name of Christ’s Church matter?” But for today, we simply ask, is the name of your religion, dear friends, is the name of your religion important or not? Let’s go there first, Brother Rommel.
Brother Rommel San Pedro: Brother Bob, the name is extremely important. Dear friends, did the apostles during the time of our Lord Jesus Christ know the true Church to have a name? And if they did, what did the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ know the name of the true Church to be? I’ll be turning right now. I’ll be reading from the ancient eastern text. This is George M. Lamsa’s translation from the Aramaic of the peshitta. This is how Acts 20:28 is rendered:
Take heed therefore to yourselves and to all the flock over which the Holy Spirit has appointed you overseers to feed the church of Christ which he has purchased with his blood.
[Acts 20:28 George M. Lamsa’s Translation]
Brother Rommel San Pedro: Very clearly we read from the Bible, from this rendition, that the name of the church is Church Of Christ. That’s how it’s recognized during the time of our Lord Jesus Christ and His apostles.
Brother Bob Pellien: Thank you, Brother Rommel, but Brother Eric, is it really important that we use that name? Yes, it’s recorded there in Acts 20:28, but is it important that we always know the name of the true Church to be Church Of Christ? Can we adjust it or change it? Many would ask, is there another name that we could also use as the title of the true church built by Christ?
Brother Eric Waterman: A very good point that you make Brother Bob. And some people think that it’s just all right to use a nickname or a shortened version, or to add the name of the town that the church is being located in. Or other such changes to the name recorded in the Bible. So is it okay that the name be altered or changed from the biblical name Church Of Christ? Allow me to read what is recorded here in Acts Chapter 4 the verses are 8 down to 12 in The Message Translation, this is recorded:
With that, Peter, full of the Holy Spirit, let loose “Rulers and leaders of the people, if we have been brought to trial today for helping a sick man, put under investigation regarding this healing, I’ll be completely frank with you– we have nothing to hide. By the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, the One you killed on a cross, the One God raised from the dead, by means of his name this man stands before you healthy and whole. Jesus is ‘the stone you masons threw out, which is now the cornerstone.’ Salvation comes no other way; no other name has been or will be given to us by which we can be saved, only this one.”
[Acts 4:8 to 12 The Message]
Brother Eric Waterman: So Brother Bob and dear viewers, the name is very important and specific for man’s salvation, according to what’s written in the Bible.
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Today’s topic:
IS THE NAME OF THE RELIGION IMPORTANT?
(THE TRUE CHURCH: PART 1)
Brother Bob Pellien: Yes Brother Eric. In fact, you even read there that there is no other name, so it can’t be changed. It cannot be altered. But you know, some still may say that, well, it’s only a name, no big deal, right? It’s only a name, and what’s really important is the correctness of the teachings, they would say. What’s really important is the practices, and what are the people like in that religion or church? That’s what many people view as important, not the name. How would the Bible respond to that, Brother Julius?
Brother Julius Malabanan: Well, Brother Bob, people should consider, how would they feel if someone would change their name? We are identified by the name that we carry. Change the name, you change the identifying characteristic. Why can’t the name be changed to someone’s liking? Anyone who wants to rename the true church? What we’ll read is from the book of Colossians. Chapter is one and the verse is 18, and this is what the Bible teaches:
And He is the head of the body, the church, …
[Colossians 1:18 New King James Version]
Brother Julius Malabanan: Here, the apostle Paul makes mention. He is referring to our Lord Jesus. Christ, is the head of the body. What is the body? The body is the Church. Who is the head of this body? It’s none other than our Lord Jesus Christ. So dear viewers, what we must understand is that the body must carry the name of the head. If you want to change the name of the head of the body or the church, he changed the whole characteristic of the church. Who built the Church? Our Lord Jesus Christ. Who owns the Church? Our Lord Jesus Christ. Who gave His precious blood for the Church Of Christ? Our Lord Jesus Christ.
Brother Bob Pellien: But Brothers, sometimes people ask this question, and it concerns the use of the George Lamsa translation of the Bible when we read Acts 20:28 where it clearly identifies the name of the Church, the Church Of Christ. The question they pose is, why is it recorded, then in other translations of the Bible, maybe, like the King James Version, for example, it says there is the Church of God, rather than Church Of Christ. Isn’t the Church of God a more accurate rendering of Acts 20:28 they ask. You know, dear friends, we got to delve into that because that’s also an important thing that needs to be understood, and that’s where we’re going to pick up this important discussion after this short break. Stay with us right here on the Iglesia Ni Cristo International Edition.
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INC International Edition
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Today’s topic: IS THE NAME OF THE RELIGION IMPORTANT?
(THE TRUE CHURCH: PART 1)
Brother Bob Pellien: Welcome back everyone to the Iglesia Ni Cristo International Edition. Before we took that short break, we posed the question that others do ask us sometimes: why do other translations of the Bible say they have Church of God instead of Church of Christ when reading Acts 20:28?
That’s a very popular question, Brother Rommel. What can you say?
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Bob Pellien
San Francisco, California
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Rommel San Pedro: I agree, Brother Bob, that is actually one of the most frequently asked questions we’re often asked. Because there are those who don’t understand yet the importance regarding the accuracy or the correct way the Bible records the true name of the church. For example, what would emerge as a conflict or a contradiction if we were to accept the wrong translations of the Bible that change a name to Church of God or various other names and appellations.
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Rommel San Pedro
London, United Kingdom
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Rommel San Pedro: Earlier, I read Acts 20:28 from the Lamsa translation. Right now, I’ll be reading Acts 20:28 from the New King James Version. Let’s compare it and see how the translators translated it here. Acts 20:28, again, I’ll be reading for the New King James Version of the Holy Bible:
Therefore take heed to yourselves and to all the flock among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers to shepherd the church of God which He purchased with His own blood.
[Acts 20:28 New King James Version]
Brother Rommel San Pedro: As you’ve heard here in this rendition, the way they translate it says “Church of God, which it purchased with His own blood.” Well, that rendering would mean, then, that it was our Lord God who died on the cross, our Lord God who shed his blood there.
Brother Bob Pellien: Wait a minute. Forgive me, Brother Rommel, if I stop you there, because, you know, the truth of the matter is, many people wouldn’t have any problem believing that, right? You know, because they don’t make any distinction between God and Christ. So to call it Church of God, or call it Church of Christ, to them, it’s just the same, and that’s what they would say, that they’re one and the same. So Church of God, Church of Christ, are both okay.
Brother Eric Waterman: But Brother Bob and dear viewers, maybe to others, that’s the case, but to anyone that based their faith on what is written in the Bible, in the Holy Scripture, it’s very different.
Brother Bob Pellien: What do you mean? It’s different. What are you saying? What do you mean, Brother Eric?
Brother Eric Waterman: Well, Brother Bob, it’s quite clear in the biblical record the truth concerning whether or not it could have been God that shed blood or died on the cross. Why? What is the nature or characteristic for the being of God Almighty as recorded in the Bible? Well, allow me to read what is recorded here in First Timothy, chapter 1, the verses 17, this is recorded:
Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible to God who alone is wise, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen.
[First Timothy 1:17 New King James Version]
Brother Eric Waterman: So Brother Bob and dear viewers, it’s very clear in the Bible that God is immortal. What does that mean? The opposite of mortality, that God cannot die and cannot be subjected to death. God is immortal.
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Eric Waterman
Quezon City, Philippines
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Julius Malabanan: That’s a wonderful verse you’ve read Brother Eric, and we just like to add on to it that the verse also states that the true God is invisible. Invisible. Let’s think about that for a moment. If one is to consider the true God is invisible. Did they nail the true God, who is invisible on the cross? If he’s invisible, he can’t be seen.
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Julius Malabanan
Saipan, Northern Marianas
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Julius Malabanan: Why does the Bible teach that the true God is invisible? What did our Lord Jesus Christ teach concerning the true nature of the true God? Let’s listen to what is recorded in the book of John. The chapter is 24 and the verses 24 and this is what it states:
God is spirit, …
[John 24:24 New King James Version]
Brother Julius Malabanan: Notice what the Bible teaches that God is Spirit. They did not nail to the cross a spirit. They nailed our Lord Jesus Christ.
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Today’s topic: IS THE NAME OF THE RELIGION IMPORTANT?
(THE TRUE CHURCH: PART 1)
Brother Bob Pellien: What are you saying there, Brother Julius? What does it mean, though, that maybe even our viewers would ask, what’s that have to do with whether or not it was God the Father or Jesus who died on the cross?
Brother Julius Malabanan: Well, let’s allow our Lord Jesus Christ, since he’s the one who said that God is a spirit. Let’s ask him, “What do you mean that God is a spirit?” I’ll now read to you what is recorded in the book of Luke chapter 24 the verses are 36 to 39 and this is what we can read:
Now, as they said these things, Jesus Himself stood in the midst of them, and said to them, “Peace to you. But they were terrified and frightened, and supposed they had seen a spirit. And He said to them, “Why are you troubled? And why do doubts arise in your hearts? Behold My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself. Handle me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see I have.”
[Luke 24:36 to 39 New King James Version]
Brother Julius Malabanan: What did the Lord Jesus Christ explain to us as to what he meant when he said, God is spirit. Well, in this instance, what we read to you is the time that our Lord Jesus Christ appeared to His disciples. What did the Bible mention? They were frightened. Why? Because they thought they had seen a spirit. What did the Lord Jesus Christ teach them? He said to them, “Why are you troubled? Why do doubts arise in your hearts?” He says, Look at me. Look and see my hands, my feet. A spirit does not have flesh and bones, as you see, I have.” The Lord Jesus Christ has flesh and bones. He has blood. A spirit does not have flesh and bones, and therefore does not have blood. The translation of George M. Lamsa in the verse Acts of the apostles 20:28 is clearly the accurate translation.
Brother Bob Pellien: Thank you for that, Brother Julius. But then, if it’s proven that it could not have been God who was nailed and shed His blood on the cross, then Brothers whose blood washed the members of the Church Of Christ from their sins according to the Bible?
Brother Rommel San Pedro: Well, Brother Bob, since it was clearly not the blood of God, we have to turn to the Bible again for the answer and ask the Bible, whose blood was it then? Here in first Peter 1:18 & 19 this so we can read:
For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life handed down to you from your ancestors, but with the precious blood of Christ, a lamb without blemish or defect.
[I Peter 1:18 New International Version]
Brother Rommel San Pedro: The Bible is very clear on this, Brother Bob and dear viewers, it was the blood of our Lord Jesus Christ, not the blood of God the Father. God does not have blood. Again, God is a Spirit. God is invisible.
Brother Eric Waterman: Excellent points, Brother Rommel. And if anyone is looking for further proof from the Holy Scripture. Let us read what is recorded here in Revelation. Chapter 1 the verse is 5. This is recorded:
and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth. To Him who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood.
[Revelation 1:5 New King James Version]
Brother Eric Waterman: So dear friends, the Bible teaches us that it was the blood of none other than our Lord, Jesus Christ, and not God, because God does not have blood. God is invisible and immortal. But the shed blood was none other than the blood of our Lord Jesus Christ that redeemed us and washed and cleansed us from our sins.
Brother Bob Pellien: So then Brothers, what then can all of our viewers learn from all these important Bible verses? What is the lesson?
Brother Julius Malabanan: We learned, Brother Bob, that Acts 20:28 rendered by George M. Lamsa, is the correct rendering of the correct name of the true Church of Christ, built by our Lord Jesus Christ. The true church is the Church Of Christ.
Brother Eric Waterman: Yes, Brother Bob and dear Brothers and dear viewers. We should always remember that having the correct name of the true Church, the Church Of Christ is but only one identifying trait of the true religion, and there are many more that.
Brother Bob Pellien: That’s really true Brother Eric, there’s a lot of identifying traits, as I mentioned earlier. That’s why we’re going to return for part two of this important discussion on identifying the true church. And then in part two, it will prove to us that the true church can also be identified by prophecy. So dear friends, be sure to return for part two. But before we go and conclude this important discussion, let’s take a look at this short video clip and how people’s lives were changed when they learned about the one true Church Of Christ and became part of it. Have a look.
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[Source: INCMedia]
Tawanda Cochrane: The Bible study that really made me like, Okay, this is where I need to be.” was the one about the true Church. And that was like, Okay, this is the true church because it says it right there in the Bible. And this is why I need to be. I need to be in the true church. I know I have salvation.
VO: Did you know that the Bible talks about a true church? Maybe it never crossed your mind. Maybe you never considered it Towanda, certainly you didn’t.
Tawanda Cochrane: It was pretty much to go to church, and as long as you go to church and have faith in God, in Jesus, you’ll be you’ll have your salvation in the end. Yes, that’s why I started going to Bible study. I was like, okay, that’s not all true. I need to be in the true Church to have salvation.
Ivan Sanchez: One thing that stuck out about that very first lesson that I heard was that the minister kept on saying that Iglesia Ni Cristo is the true Church, the only true Church. And that’s something that I was thinking, well, at least the church, this church, is being honest about that, about them saying that.
VO: But don’t take our word for it. Investigate it for yourself. They did.
Jennie Guerrero: I asked a lot of questions, and the minister was very patient with me, and read the Bible and showed me passages, and I remember asking him, “if this is the true Church, how are there so many miracles happening around the world?” You know, from other ministers, preachers, churches. I remember he read the verse Matthew 24:24:
For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect.
[Matthew 24:24 New King James Version]
Jennie Guerrero: And I remember he read that, and I was like, wow, okay, that makes a lot of sense. And from that day forth, I started attending more Bible studies.
Mary Guevarra: I remember sitting there and listening to every word and just, I just start bawling with the tears because I felt shocked that my mother had, all my life, taught me that all these things were okay, and I’m like, it was the realization that all those feelings I had were right. That she was wrong, and I had been being taught the wrong way.
Grace Fedra: I was reading and learning more about the church, I realized that there’s only one true God. As versus to many other churches, there’s so many gods, but there’s only one true church, and there’s only one God, which is the Father in heaven and our Lord Jesus Christ is the mediator. So that was really important to know the truth.
VO: You may never have considered it, but if you’ve been attending a church all your life, wouldn’t you want to know you were going to the one that is true?
Ivan Sanchez: And it was after that that I felt like, hey, this church, this is different. This church is actually teaching the true teachings from the Bible, because it wasn’t complicated to understand, and that’s what made me want to continue, and that’s what I when I realized this is where God wants me to be.
VO: Set up a time to speak with a minister in the church of Christ and discover the answers you need to hear.
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Brother Bob Pellien: You know, Brothers, those individuals noted in that video clip, really how happy they are to have found the one true church of Christ. You notice that?
Brother Eric Waterman: Yes, Brother Bob, we can see that they were inspired to seek out the truth and to find the true religion which was based on the Bible. How it changed their lives, how, indeed, they decided to have the Bible-based teachings come alive in their life, to change their religion, to understand the name and to understand the true faith that is based on the Bible, and as we witnessed, it indeed changed their lives.
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Eric Waterman
Quezon City, Philippines
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Rommel San Pedro: Brother Eric, it’s very important for people to realize that it’s not easy for people to change their religion. So they’re looking for answers to their questions. And from one of the comments made, I asked the minister all these questions, and he was so patient with me. That’s why the ministers of the Church Of Christ are very patient. We want to answer questions. And in this episode, the question that was answered is the importance of the name, and now you know the importance. So now you know what you need to do.
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Rommel San Pedro
London, United Kingdom
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Julius Malabanan: Dear guests, dear friends that are viewing this program. Let’s leave you with a thought: Of all the things that you could have been doing today, of all the things that you could be viewing today. Why were you able to listen to these truths? These truths are for you, for you to investigate, to take a look. How important is it to take a look, to ask those important questions? Just like what you’ve heard from the testimony of our Brothers and sisters, it’s life changing, and that is what we hope all of us would do is change for the better, change for the truth, and change to be saved.
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Julius Malabanan
Saipan, Northern Marianas
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Bob Pellien: Thank you, Brother Julius. So dear friends, we’ll look again at another important identifying characteristic of the one true church Christ built.
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Bob Pellien
San Francisco, California
Minister of the Gospel
Brother Bob Pellien: In part two, we’re going to pick up asking if the true church is prophesying. And in part three, as we have mentioned, we’ll be looking at yet another important trait, or identifying characteristic of the true Church, and that is the true church knows the true God.
Brother Bob Pellien: Let’s continue our study together in these important topics in our next episode of the Iglesia Ni Cristo International Edition. But for now, we just want to thank you for joining us in our study today. And we’d also like to thank our panelists: Brother Eric Waterman in Quezon City, Philippines, Brother Rommel San Pedro in the United Kingdom in London, as well as Brother Julius Malabanan in Saipan there in Micronesia. Thank you Brothers for giving to us Bible-based answers so that you can always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks to give the reason for the hope that you have at First Peter 3:15.
Be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks to give the reason for the hope that you have.
[I Peter 3:15 New International Version]
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