Planning a Wedding During COVID-19

[Show opens]

Myrtle Alegado: Worry, pressure, and stress. Lots of stress. A staggering 96% of couples admit to feeling this emotion while planning their wedding according to a study of 500 newlywed or engaged to be wed couples published on brides.com.

These numbers are even more telling – “40% of couples categorized wedding planning as “extremely stressful” while 71% thought it was more nerve-wracking than other major life events like finding a new job.”

Now, that article was published before COVID-19. Today, we’re going to look at what planning a wedding was like for one newlywed couple I had a chance to chat with who got married during the global pandemic.

Welcome to Happy Life, a podcast brought to you by INCMedia that aims to help newlyweds navigate through the first years of marriage. I’m Myrtle Alegado and I’ve been married to my husband Paul since 1999.

[INTRO MUSIC & CATCHPHRASE]

Inspiration to make your marriage thrive, you’re listening to Happy Life.

Myrtle: Planning every detail of your big day really does take a lot of work. The happy couple has to decide on things like guest lists, decor, and even the reception venue.  When you add a global pandemic into the equation of wedding planning, you’ve got a whole new set of unexpected hurdles.

Let’s welcome our newlyweds for today’s topic, Kara and Alvin, from Saint John, New Brunswick, Canada. Hi Kara and Alvin! We’re so happy you’re here with us today.

Kara Pascual: Hello, Myrtle. Thank you so much for having us today on Happy Life. And Alvin and I are so grateful to take part in this topic, which is very timely for us. Right, Alvin?

Alvin Pascual: Yeah, but definitely quite nervous.

Myrtle: Aww, no need to be nervous. So how have you two been, you know, aside from the nervousness?

Kara: Well, of course we also gained weight as part of marriage.

Myrtle: Oh, I think that’s part of the COVID-10 or COVID-15 people say.

Kara: COVID-15!

Myrtle: Everybody’s  putting on 10 or 15 pounds. Can you explain where St. John is and what it’s like there?

Kara: So, St. John is in the province of New Brunswick, which is part of the 10 provinces here in Canada. And we’re also part of the Atlantic provinces in the eastern part of the country.

Myrtle: And I had to actually Google Map it and even though I’m Canadian, and I’ve lived here all my life, I had to refresh my memory. I believe it’s also between Quebec and Nova Scotia and then just a little bit north of Maine, correct?

Alvin: That’s correct. So it’s actually two hours away from the US border which is the State of Maine.

Myrtle: Okay so, Kara and Alvin, you’ve been married since August of 2020, correct?

Kara: Yep.

Myrtle: And that wasn’t originally supposed to be your wedding date though right, so can you share the story on that?

Alvin: I proposed to Kara in May 2018 in Niagara Falls, Ontario. So, that was actually the happiest moment of my life at that point. We encountered a lot of challenges along the way, especially we have differing personalities. I am an introvert and Kara is an extrovert. So, a lot of challenges personally, within our internal selves, and together as a couple, as we’re going through the relationship. We encountered that after the proposal. So, we decided to call off the wedding and eventually had to separate, because we realized that we needed to grow as individuals, before we can go together.

Myrtle: And you know that actually makes a lot of sense, because there’s a saying I heard a while back that went something like ‘before you could stand together, you had to stand alone.’ So, what you said, growing as individuals, I’m sure that now has helped you together as a couple. So, after experiencing all of that, you know, having the proposal, being engaged, then calling off the wedding, the roller coaster of ups and downs, what was it like for you to finally be able to plan the wedding together?

Kara: Actually, Myrtle, we were so excited, because we will finally get to restart the planning of our wedding.

Myrtle: Right.

Kara: But then we are [in] a long distance relationship, because I live in St. John here in New Brunswick, and he was in Surrey, British Columbia, at that time. So Surrey is, I think it’s in the Metro Vancouver [area]—

Myrtle: Right.

Kara: —as far as I know, and St. John is near the Bay of Fundy. So, I am beside the waters.

Myrtle: So, literally you’re [on] other sides of the country.

Kara: Yeah, other sides, west and east.

Myrtle: You’re that far apart in distance, different time zones, so how did you stay organized and on track with all your wedding planning.

Kara: Well, Alvin is the techie type of person, and he’s really organized. I guess it’s because of his job. So, he created a Google spreadsheet for us to keep everything on track, to see our progress, to see what we’ve missed, and we always check it every month, and then it goes to every week.

And I am really happy even though that we are both far away from each other. I am really thankful that Alvin’s family is very supportive, because I only have them as my family since my parents, my siblings, are in the Philippines. I know it’s very unfortunate that they are far away from me, but they still give support by giving me advice on how to do the wedding, even though we’re far away from each other.

Myrtle: That’s really great. And actually the spreadsheet is a great idea to stay organized, so good job, Alvin.

Alvin: Thank you.

Myrtle: And we heard, you know almost all couples admit to feeling stress during wedding planning. What were your stress levels like, you know, especially since you were planning your wedding during a global pandemic and you have the distance as well to handle?

Alvin: So, I’m not really the type of person that stresses too much. Because I realized that in order to get this wedding planning to work is if one person is easily stressed out, the other person needs to be calm and be able to think things through. That’s why I was able to be organized and bring solutions like using a spreadsheet to see the progress, things like that. So, that helped me to reduce my stress.

Kara: Well it’s very opposite for me, because I am 110% stressed at that time.

Myrtle: Oh.

Kara: Well, I think it’s because I’m far from Alvin and from a family. It’s really hard to interact with one another if you’re far away. It’s different when you can see each other. You can talk to each other right away.

And there’s a lot of restrictions when COVID-19 started in early 2020. All of us are so nervous because flights got suspended. Actually here in St. John, in the whole province of New Brunswick actually, they suspended the whole flights so there’s no airports open [at] that time.

Myrtle: Oh.

Kara: Yes, everything is closed. Even the stores are closed. So while I was searching for a gown, I couldn’t find the perfect gown for me, because I don’t really like looking online. Because what if I receive it and then I have to alter it because it’s too small for me or it’s too big for me. And stores are closed so I don’t have a way to alter the dress, and it’s really hard to make decorations. And the worst thing is, we really don’t know if the wedding will be pushed through because of this pandemic,

Myrtle: And I think initially when we spoke, you had hoped to get married earlier in 2020, not in August, right?

Kara: Yes.

Myrtle: But then like you said the pandemic hit. And so in addition to the wedding date, what other changes did you kind of have to accept and deal with because of, you know, pandemic and lockdown and everything?

Alvin: So, the toughest thing was that Kara’s family could not make it to the wedding because of the government restrictions. We really wish we could have changed that, because it would be very valuable for their family to witness the wedding ceremony in itself.

Kara: And to add to that, my family’s not members of the Church Of Christ, and I really would want them to witness how the wedding is done inside the Church, and how solemn it is. Because I also wanted them to be part of this Church.

Myrtle: And you said that there were a lot of government restrictions as well, right? Did you have to do a lot of research when it came to that, such as how many people were allowed to gather, and how did that affect your guest list?

Kara: Well, yes I actually checked the government restrictions, every month and then every week, because I find that they change the rules, very often. So, at first, the maximum capacity indoors in British Columbia is 50 guests or 50 people. And then they lowered it to 25. It’s really hard to determine who will be in the chapel, because we also have people who are dear to us that we want to be with on our wedding day. But then, we couldn’t because we have to follow those restrictions.

But of course, people can’t travel anyway, so we are thankful to the Church Administration, because they approved us having a video streaming for them so they can attend to our wedding, even though it’s virtually. And to my surprise, to our surprise, a lot of them were able to connect. More of them were able to witness the wedding, than going to British Columbia personally to see the wedding. So I’m happy with that because we were able to share our very special day to our dear loved ones and friends.

Myrtle: Oh yes, definitely. And that’s pretty incredible that a lot of people, a lot of your guests, were able to actually watch it even though, like you said, it was virtually. But just having them there, I’m sure, was something that you will remember.

So here’s an interesting statistic I’d like to share with you. Zola surveyed over 2000 couples with weddings from March 2020 and December 2022. Most of them were originally scheduled to get married in 2020 and found that COVID-19 has changed the way that almost all of them are thinking, feeling and planning. You know, with having to decide how to handle the guest list, based on restrictions in each city or province, or how to implement safety protocols at the ceremony, and most importantly how to still celebrate with loved ones, even though they’re far away, it’s definitely a lot to think about. So Kara and Alvin, what do you recall was one of the biggest stressors during your wedding planning?

Kara: Well for me, Myrtle, I am a frontliner, I’m a nurse here in St. John. And being in the period of the pandemic, It’s very stressful.

Myrtle: I can imagine, yes.

Kara: Most of our residents here are at home, while we are still working in our respective jobs. That resulted for me to have a lot of health issues because, of course, when you stress out, your body will react to the stressors. I was hospitalized many times because of that.

Myrtle : Oh no.

Kara: I think it’s because of fatigue, too much thinking, anxiety, and we were also short-staffed every day, because my co-workers were also getting sick of working every day. Because we cannot have our vacation time because of this pandemic. On top of that, I have to do the wedding planning with Alvin.

Myrtle: Stress on top of stress.

Kara: Yes, stress on top of stress on top of stress. That’s how I can tell it. Two weeks before the wedding, I got injured at work. That made me become more stressed.

Myrtle: Yes, definitely. I mean, how did that injury happen if you don’t mind me asking?

Kara: I was in the Alzheimer’s unit, and one of my patients got very aggressive and hit me on the head, and I lost consciousness. Yes, I had a concussion, and I was sent to the emergency after that. And I was so nervous that our wedding will be canceled because of my situation. It’s only two weeks left. I really did my best to do my devotional prayers, and to do the physio religiously. I didn’t skip any day of my physio, because I really wanted to be with Alvin. Because it’s really hard to be living by yourself, that’s why I really prayed a lot. But then another thing. I felt very uncertain because my flight keeps on [getting] re-booked by the airline. So, I really don’t know what will happen to our wedding

Myrtle: So you had more hurdles than most normal couples, for sure, when wedding planning. But how did you show support to one another during this time, especially you, Alvin? You knew that Kara got injured. How did you support each other during this time?

Alvin: So, the important thing that we realized is communication and honesty is key. We had daily video calls so we can communicate with each other what’s happening, when it comes to the wedding planning, when it comes to ourselves personally. So, we also did things to uplift each other, like funny faces, like funny video calls and things like that.

Myrtle: Thank goodness for modern technology, right, that you can have those video calls nowadays.

Alvin: Exactly. And especially we were able to send each other quotes and different social media posts that helped lift each other in these hard times.

Myrtle: Yes, definitely. And you also continued to stay active within your faith and, you know, attending worship services?

Alvin: Definitely, those are the one of the key things that help us uplift ourselves internally, is with the performance of our duties and making sure our faith is complete.

Kara: Yes. And, in addition to that, we also trusted each other more, especially that we are far away from each other. Because if you don’t have trust [in] your partner, you will be more stressed.

Myrtle: For sure.

Kara: Yes, and most importantly, we trusted everything to our Almighty God, because we all know that everything happens for a reason. I know LDR (long-distance relationship) is very hard. So, why make it harder, right? So, make it lighter.

Myrtle: Yeah, true.

With any type of planning, there are always uncertainties, but planning for your big day during a global pandemic, you can be sure to expect the unexpected. We heard about the changes and turn of events that Kara and Alvin experienced. Now, whether you’re presently engaged or already a married couple, are you currently dealing with something similar, with something unexpected which is now having an impact on your relationship? If you are, then we invite you now to listen closely to some advice from the Bible on how to deal with the unexpected. Let’s welcome back a minister of the gospel in the Church Of Christ, Brother Felmar Serreno. Hi, Brother Felmar and welcome back to Happy Life.

Brother Felmar Serreno: Hello, Myrtle and hello to all the Happy Life listeners, and hello to our guests for today, Kara and Alvin. I remember hearing at the introduction, in your courtship it was a long distance relationship, right? I think Alvin was in Surrey, British Columbia, and Kara was it St. John?

Kara: St. John, New Brunswick.

Brother Felmar: St. John, New Brunswick. I wanted to ask, where have you decided to settle, here on the west side or over there on the east side?

Kara: Well, that’s a very difficult question. (laughs) But of course we want to be near the family. So, we want to settle on the west side.

Brother Felmar: On the west coast, okay. But currently, you’re still out there in St. John, New Brunswick. Is that right, Kara?

Kara: Yes, we’re just waiting for some papers to be completed and we will go back to the west side, the west coast.

Brother Felmar: Okay, I see. How is it over there in St. John at the moment?

Kara: Well right now, the Atlantic bubble, which means that all the Atlantic provinces, New Brunswick, Nova Scotia and PEI/Prince Edward Island and Newfoundland and Labrador, will finally be open for travel. So, well you have to quarantine for 14 days if you’re from outside the Atlantic bubble.

Brother Felmar: I see, okay. Well, thank you for sharing that with us. Onto our discussion now, dealing with the unexpected. So, should we be surprised or discouraged when things don’t turn out the way we planned? Let’s listen to what the Bible says here in the book of Proverbs, chapter 16, verse one in the Good News Translation, and we’ll read verse nine in the New Century Version:

We may make our plans, but God has the last word.

[Proverbs 16:1 Good News Translation]

People may make plans in their minds, but the LORD decides what they will do.

[Proverbs 16:9 New Century Version]

Brother Felmar: The Bible teaches us, “We may make our plans, but God has the last word.” Therefore, it is a truth, it is a given, that how we plan things out will not always play out the same way. Why? Because in all things, “God has the last word.” What is the equivalent of this? It is God’s will or God’s plans that will prevail above all. God may allow certain plans we make to be fulfilled, or He may have something else planned for us. Nevertheless, it is always for our own good.

Now, just in case you’re wondering, why are we so sure that God has good plans for us? For example, someone might say if God has good plans in store for us, then why did those unexpected and difficult changes happen to Kara and Alvin, like what they shared with us earlier? And maybe some of our listeners are going through something similar. Shouldn’t those moments be seen as something negative rather than good? So, in response to that, let’s ask the Bible this: how do God’s faithful servants regard what happens in their life, even if it is very different from what was originally planned? Let’s turn to the book of Romans, chapter eight, verse 28, in the Christian Community Bible:

We know that in everything, God works for the good of those who love him, whom he has called, according to his plan.

[Romans 8:28 Christian Community Bible]

Brother Felmar: According to the Bible, not just some but all of the things that happen—all of the things that happen—in the life of those whom God called and truly love Him, even if they are severe, these things are not detrimental to them. Who are those whom God has called? According to Colossians, chapter 3, verse 15, those whom God has called are in the one body of Christ. The one body is the true Church, Colossians 1:18. And what is the name of the true Church? Church Of Christ—that is based on Acts, chapter 20, verse 28 in the Lamsa Translation.    

So, for us members of the Church Of Christ that truly love God, in everything that happens in our life we see it in a positive way. Although, yes, when you’re in the moment, something unexpected and unfortunate may seem to be disadvantageous for you. I remember with what Kara mentioned earlier how she was concerned and sad that it seemed as if her loved ones would not be able to witness the marriage ceremony. Did I get that correctly, Kara?

Kara: Yes, yes.

Brother Felmar: And especially because, you know, with how you value your membership in the Church Of Christ, you were hoping that they could witness the solemnity of the marriage ceremony as done in the Church Of Christ. So, what has been mentioned to us through the Holy Scriptures and going through our experiences, definitely when you’re in the moment, things that are unexpected seem disadvantageous. However it is our faith, and it’s taught by the Bible, that God can turn things around so that even unpleasant experiences will be for our own good or it will work toward our benefit in the end.

In fact, what is one example in the Bible that we can learn from where in hindsight, God’s servants understood that the catastrophe they went through turned out to be for their own good in the end? Let’s cite the experience of the apostle Paul, in 2 Corinthians, chapter 1, verses 8 to 10 in The Message:

We don’t want you in the dark, friends, about how hard it was when all this came down on us in Asia province. It was so bad we didn’t think we were going to make it. We felt like we’d been sent to death row, that it was all over for us. As it turned out, it was the best thing that could have happened. Instead of trusting in our own strength or wits to get out of it, we were forced to trust God totally—not a bad idea since he’s the God who raises the dead! And he did it, rescued us from certain doom. And he’ll do it again, rescuing us as many times as we need rescuing.

[2 Corinthians 1:8-10 The Message]

Brother Felmar: In spite of the severe trials Apostle Paul experienced, in hindsight he understood that “it was the best thing that could have happened.” That’s what he said, right? Well, why did he say that? Because the experience produced something in him. What positive and important result came out of the unpleasant experience Apostle Paul went through? He witnessed how God rescued Him from certain doom and he learned to trust God totally.

Therefore, to the newlyweds and even to the engaged couples who are listening to this podcast, no matter how incredibly different a circumstance may be from your original plan, there is no reason for us to be overcome by frustration or disappointment. Instead, let us put our unwavering trust in God. Trust in His promise that He has good plans for us. Trust also in the fact that in everything, God works for the good of those who love Him.

Myrtle: Thank you once again, Brother Felmar, for teaching us these words of wisdom from the Bible, and for reminding us to always trust in God.

Brother Felmar: Thank you again to the Happy Life team for having me. Thank you to you, Myrtle. Thank you to our guests, Kara and Alvin. You’ve been great, although I think you mentioned before that this may have been your first time, you know, appearing on a podcast like this but we definitely appreciate the experiences you shared from the heart and openly, and I’m sure all the newlyweds, who are listening in, appreciate it as well. God bless to us all.

Myrtle: So based on the Bible advice that we just received, how important has it been for you to trust in God?

Alvin: Through technology, so we had video calls, we were able to hold daily devotional prayers. Because of our daily devotional prayers, we felt more confident because we put our complete hope to our Almighty God and what He can do for us.

Kara: And actually, Myrtle, my prayers were answered by doing constant devotional prayers. I told you earlier that the stores were closed here in St. John during my wedding gown search, and a few weeks before my flight, one store got open. And I had a hard time to find a gown, because I wanted it to be very conservative, but then I am so happy that I found the gown that I’ve been looking for. And that’s one prayer answered.

And next, the St. John airport was closed for a while, I think for three to four months.

Myrtle: That’s a long time.

Kara: Yes, I kept on praying—I kept on praying—that it will open for our wedding day. And I am so glad that it opened [in] July, 2020 and my wedding is [in] August, and my flight is on the 25th of July. So I’m so happy that it opened, because I am really nervous if it’s still closed if the wedding will be postponed again. And also, we prayed a lot that I will be kept safe and away from the disease because I am flying, right, so I’ll be encountering many passengers on the flight.

And thankfully—I’m really thankful to our Almighty Father—that I got through all that. I am safe, nothing happened to me, I did not get any sicknesses from the COVID-19. And we still got married on our desired date, which is amazing! Looking back, we got very anxious, we got very worried if this wedding will happen. We entrusted everything to God. We didn’t doubt, and we put our complete hope in Him. Everything just went very smoothly. I know there were obstacles. but then we treat those obstacles as a challenge for us to trust in Him more. And the end result is we got married. Yay!

Myrtle: Yay! So many answered prayers, so what would you tell, you know, couples right now who are engaged and about to get married in this pandemic? What would some of your advice be?

Kara: First advice. I know we have friends and families that pressure us to get married because of our age, you know, or if you have a circle of friends and you’re the only ones who are single, they always keep on telling you, “When are you getting married? You’re getting old,” something like that. So don’t get pressured on that, because marriage is not a joke. Marriage is sacred and it comes with a huge responsibility, because you will eventually create a family of your own, and you need to be very responsible for that.

I know there will be struggles, and a lot of frustrations with the wedding planning. It’s normal because, as what was stated earlier, wedding planning is really stressful. So you just have to work together with your partner. It involves teamwork and without teamwork, like what happened to us before, our initial wedding didn’t push through because of a lot of differences and things didn’t work out as planned. But then, if you include God during your wedding planning, everything will be worthwhile—everything will happen smoothly just like what happened to us. And you just want to get married, right? So, you have to just complete the process. Just believe that you will go to your end goal which is getting married.

Myrtle: So Alvin, what are your two cents on the topic of advice for engaged-to be-wed couples right now?

Alvin: So, like what Kara said, everything happens in God’s perfect time. You might make plans, you might make different kinds of plans, but in the end God will allow His plan to happen. And for us, that’s exactly what happened. So everything went smoothly, when even though it was just a short while that we planned the wedding, it went very smoothly, despite all the obstacles that have happened. We were able to get married as a result. That brings us a lot of joy, brings the newlyweds a lot of joy, once that process is complete.

Myrtle: The long wait is over and you’re finally husband and wife. So I can imagine, you know, how happy you both felt.

Kara: Yes, actually, we planned this wedding for less than a month.

Myrtle: Oh, wow.

Kara: Yeah, less than a month. We didn’t expect everything will push through. Initially, 2018, we planned for a whole year. It didn’t happen. But God’s time is really perfect. Even though it’s during the pandemic, it’s perfect for us.

Myrtle: So thank you, Kara and Alvin, so much for sharing what you both went through with all your wedding planning and all the hurdles that you had to jump over, but we hope you had as much fun talking about it as we did.

Kara: Thank you so much, Myrtle, for having us. It is such a good experience, and we had a fun time talking about our wedding planning, like it’s a reminiscing moment for us.

Alvin: I was definitely nervous when we first started, but as we were discussing this, I felt more comfortable. And hopefully our experiences while we were planning our wedding, especially during this pandemic, was of some benefit for everyone else that’s listening.

Myrtle: We hope our discussion today was able to show all of the engaged couples out there that having a wedding during the pandemic is definitely doable. The important thing to remember is to trust God with your plans.

And that’s all we have for you today. To learn more about Christian relationships, please visit incmedia.org. And if you’d like to say hi or send us a question, please email us at info@incmedia.org with the subject Happy Life. Please also remember to share our podcast with your family and friends and all the newlyweds that you know.

Thank you from all of us here on the Happy Life team. We’re so glad you joined us today and hope we’ve all been reminded about the blessing of marriage.

[Show closes]

HAPPY LIFE PODCAST

SEASON 1, EPISODE 5 –

Communication in Marriage: Disagreements

[Show opens]

Myrtle Alegado (host): Disagreements, quarrels, little arguments, or squabbles, these are all terms people use when there’s some conflict. And in marriage, some may say that little disputes or disagreements can be healthy, and even help you learn more about your spouse. But conflict that recurs or lingers over an extended period of time could have negative consequences on married life. And let’s talk about that today.

Welcome to Happy Life. This new podcast, brought to you by INCMedia, helps newlyweds navigate through the first months and years of marriage to remind us all that marriage is a blessing. I’m Myrtle Alegado and I’ve been married to my husband, Paul, since 1999.

[Catchphrase]

Inspiration to make your marriage thrive, you’re listening to Happy Life.

Myrtle: On the website psychologytoday.com, they mentioned something called the Romantic Relationships Scale, and there are 30 items that cover the sources of disagreements in romantic relationships.

Some of them included: not showing enough love or affection, lack of communication, one not paying enough attention to the other, and not being appreciated, things that deal with chores and responsibilities like housekeeping, and other tasks at home and who does more work. And finally, these items such as goals in life, future plans, children, who should pay for something, or if one uses all the other’s money.

And to share their thoughts on disagreements in marriage, we have Martin and Erica, who are newlyweds from Toronto, Ontario, Canada. They got married [in] October of 2019. Hi Zerrudos! How are you two doing?

Martin Zerrudo: Hi!

Erica Zerrudo: Hi!

Martin Zerrudo: Thanks for having us.

Myrtle: How are you today?

Erica: We’re doing well, doing well. Thank you for asking.

Martin: [laughs] Excited to be part of this show. Thank you for having us.

Myrtle: From the list that I just read to you, can you relate to one of those reasons for disagreements or a few or maybe all of them?

Erica: [laughs] Well, I think definitely at first, you know, you’re adjusting to each other. So, definitely the lack of communication and maybe one not paying enough attention to the other, and you know, not showing enough love or affection when the other person needs it, definitely.

Martin: Yeah, I think because we were long distance, right, you can really show affection just through the phone or through a video call or you know, sending each other care packages. But once we were married, you know, very much excited to be in love and to be with each other physically, but we were still trying to kind of figure out, like you know, when you’re on the same flow in terms of when is the right time to show affection—does somebody need more, does somebody need less? And you’re kind of just learning that as you go along, because you know, we didn’t have the ability to kind of figure that out because we were long-distance. So I think, definitely that. We’re working from home during the pandemic and it just so happens that the pandemic was the same time as the first year of our marriage.

Erica [laughs]

Myrtle: Right, yeah.

Martin: And so we got to spend the time together physically because we had to stay at home, but at the same time, I’m working from home so it didn’t necessarily allow me to give the focused attention that I could have even if we were in the same space for a long time.

Myrtle: Yeah, definitely. Everybody’s busy these days with, you know, multitasking. And you did mention you were both in a long distance relationship prior to marriage. So, what do you wish you had known about facing disagreements together before saying your “I dos?”

Erica: You want to take this one?

Martin: [laughs]

Myrtle: [laughs] You’re both pointing fingers at each other?

Erica: Yeah! [laughs]

Martin: Yeah, no, pointing smiles at each other. Who wants to take this one? No, you take it, honey. No…

So for a long distance, yeah, obviously, the only way that that’s going to survive—outside of prayer and having faith that you’re meant to be—is communication. And, you know, just to be quite frank, like, we’re 9 years apart, and so Erica is in her early 20s and I’m in my early 30s, and so we’re at different stages in life. And so, the things that we’re going through from day to day, whether it be work or duties or responsibilities, they’re different.

And so we had to adapt to that and be mindful of that, knowing that, you know, there are certain things that she has to do at this stage in her life, there are certain things that I have to do at my stage in life. And if we wanted to make the relationship work, we just have to be conscious and aware of that so that we can communicate effectively, you know?

Myrtle: Right.

Martin: Her hour or window of opportunity to communicate may not always be the same for me, and vice versa, just because we have different responsibilities and lifestyles. So, definitely, that was one of the challenges and areas of disagreement, is finding those windows where we’re, we’re both available to give quality time for each other.

Erica: [agrees] I feel like it’s also, mistakes are for learning, kind of deal. You try and bring up a problem or you know, just something that’s been on your mind. And you see if this is a good timing, oh it’s not a good timing. You gotta read what’s his headspace, what his day was like. Okay, maybe he likes it, when we’re both sitting down, when we’re both calm, when we both don’t have a lot on our schedule anymore, then I can bring it up and we can have as much time as we need for this conversation to happen.

Myrtle: You know, what Martin said, a few of our other couples have said, you know, our spouse isn’t a mind-reader. So adjusting to, you know, the little nuances of how the other person may kind of, react to certain things or scenarios and even words, that was probably a big thing, in terms of adjusting to each other.

But can I also ask you, you said you finally moved in together during the pandemic and you had to go through those adjustments. So Erica, can you talk a little bit about what that situation was like?

Erica: Yes. So when we first got married, when I first arrived to Canada, at the time Martin was living with his parents, so we adjusted, like, living into his room which at the time was a twin bed, it was—

Myrtle: Oh [laughs]

Erica: —a cute little closet, yeah. And so… [laughs] Moving in with my, you know, suitcases and luggages, we were like “Oh man, where are we going to put everything?”

Martin: Can I just pause? So, we live in Toronto. In Toronto, you know, it’s a metropolis. We live in a townhouse, multiple levels. So, Toronto is all about, like dense, compact living, right?

Myrtle: Right.

Martin: And Erica is from the South. She’s from Atlanta and her house is a little bit off into the suburbs. So she’s got a, you know she grew up, at least when she was in Atlanta, in this huge property, huge backyard.

Erica: It’s not huge.

Martin: I mean, for her it’s not huge, but in comparison to a townhouse in Toronto, it’s, like, gigantic. And so, like, her bedroom has a queen bed, she has her own walk-in closet, she has her own bathroom, and that’s the norm. It’s not like she’s wealthy or anything,

Myrtle: Oh, wow.

Martin: But that’s just the norm in the community in the area where she lives, where it’s just massive properties and houses. Whereas here in Toronto, the norm is, yeah, we’re either all in buildings or in townhouses. It’s very densely populated. So you can imagine her adjustment like, “Hey, thanks for marrying me. Let’s live in this box.”

Erica: [laughs]

Myrtle: [laughs] Although I’m sure she was, you know, very grateful that your parents allowed you to both move in there and get your start in life.

Erica: Absolutely. Especially, you know, financially. So, they’re very understanding, and we’re very grateful for that. They always tell us, all the time, “Hey, if you want to like come over,” or “Here’s some food to help you guys out a little bit.” They’re always sweet to us, so we’re always thankful for that. They tried their best, you know, helping me to adapt to a new city, new life, marriage.

Martin: (faintly) Winter.

Erica: Yeah, winter in the quarantine,-

Myrtle: [laughs] Winter.

Erica: –which no one’s gone through before. So yeah, just, you had to adapt to, not only, your husband, but his parents, to his siblings and also his sibling’s wife, so the in-laws as well. So, it was pretty packed in the house, but you adjust to each other’s scheduling and where to navigate yourself in the house and how each other, like, how they like to clean… yeah.

Myrtle: So during that time, you know, when you were together and you had disagreements, how did you adjust to each other and how did you handle them?

Martin: I think, I mean one of the challenges is, you know, we’re in a bedroom but not necessarily the most private in terms of like other people in the home. You don’t want to argue in front of other people but sometimes you’re upset at each other and you’re standing in the kitchen. Like, what do we do?

Myrtle: Right, yeah.

Martin: You’re upset with each other, but you’re in the living room and somebody’s trying to watch TV, like it’s pretty awkward. I remember the late Brother Rod Bruno, we were actually recording an episode of Heart and Soul, and he gave me this example. He goes, “It doesn’t really matter if the wife is right or if the husband is right, because the point is, in principle—the point is peace.”

Myrtle: Right.

Martin: And so, when it came to those small disagreements that we would have, in the first year of our marriage, in the shared townhome with my family, we really had to focus on that. Okay, you did something, I got upset. I did something, you got upset. But the point is, not who’s right or wrong, but peace. And that’s really how we were able to get through it, was with that mindset.

Myrtle: That’s a great mindset, and you know, with the pandemic going on and so much happening, there’s so much worry, so much stress, there’s loss. How has that affected how you handle disagreements with each other?

Erica: We have loved ones, you know, pass away.

Myrtle: Oh, I’m sorry to hear that.

Erica: Just, either health issues or from COVID. But either way, we learned that, you know, life’s too short to be fighting. That at the end of the day, you know, it’s about love and peace.

Myrtle: So Martin, I want to go to the blog that you wrote and it was what you learned in the first 100 days of marriage. And in your blog, you kind of kept mentioning that you would just say sorry and say sorry to-

Martin: [laughs]

Myrtle: -like you said, to avoid arguments, right?

Martin: Yeah.

Myrtle: But then Erica, kind of, caught on and can you elaborate a little bit about that?

Erica: It was like, “Okay, you’re saying sorry, but why? Why are you saying sorry?” And he was like, “I don’t know why I’m saying sorry. I just don’t want to fight anymore, so I thought sorry would do it.”

Martin: And maybe that kind of worked for like the first couple, but then, afterwards she just started to catch on and I started to catch on because it’s good as like a bandaid, like temporarily.

Myrtle: Right.

Martin: Like, “Hey, let’s pick our battles. So, we’re not going to fight about this one. Okay, you’re sorry, I’m sorry—okay, great.” But then, for the things that, maybe it really matters for Erica, for us to kind of delve into what’s going on, and vice versa, if I’m like, “Hey don’t just say sorry. I want to know, I want to be able to communicate and go through what’s happening.” You can’t just kind of blanket it with ‘I’m sorry.’

Myrtle: Mmhmm.

Martin: That’s kind of what was my approach. For me, I’m very like, I guess stereotypically, like A to B. For a guy, “What’s the problem? Okay, what did I do? What did I say? Is that what I said? Is that what I did? Okay, I’m sorry for what I said, I’m sorry for what I did. Are we okay now?”

Erica: Promise.

Martin: “I promise I won’t do this again. I’m sorry—okay great.”

Myrtle: [laughs]

Martin: And sometimes you kind of just want to shortcut it like, “You’re mad? Okay, great. I’m sorry, I’m so sorry. Okay cool, can we just move on now?”

Myrtle: Just get to the ‘I’m sorry’. [laughs]

Martin: Yeah, let’s get to the ‘I’m sorry’ and I think, you know, it’s not necessarily fair whether you’re a guy or you’re a girl, and you’re kind of the person that wants, at that moment, to digest it. Sometimes, you just want to be able to communicate how you feel and have that person hear how you feel, and to kind of just get that door closed on you, like, “I’m sorry!”—it’s not very considerate of the other person emotionally-

Myrtle: For sure, yeah.

Martin: -and vice versa. What if I’m in that moment where I want to be able to express how I feel and then she’s like, “It’s fine, I’m sorry”, and that’s it? It’s not very, it’s not always conducive when it comes to emotional growth.

Myrtle: And then for resolving conflict, it sounds like you kind of both have different ways of going about it as well?

Martin: Yeah, I think, I mean Erica’s very blunt. I can also be blunt, but I think Erica just is naturally very open with how she’s feeling at the moment. Early on, you might be like, “Wow, why are you saying those things?” It might come across as rude or mean or unkind, but for me I have to learn, what is the intention of it?

If she’s saying something, is it to help me, to correct me, to show me something that I need to change, you know? And then other times, maybe yeah, she’s emotional and she’s upset, but being able to read that helps in resolving a conflict. Because while it doesn’t help if I get caught up in misreading her intention, and then I’m just getting mad over the wrong thing or I’m just getting mad over something that’s not necessarily speaking to why she’s saying those things.

And for me, like, I grew up in a household of like constant yelling. And I remember when I was a kid one time, I was like, “Mom,” like she was yelling about something. And I don’t even think she was necessarily mad. I said, “Hey, can you not yell? You can just tell me what you want me to do without yelling. Like, why are you always yelling?” She turned to me, she was like, “I yell because I yell, okay? I just yell.”

Myrtle: [laughs]

Martin: So, I think, when we got married, in those moments where you may get emotional or might get upset, and I may think like, “Oh, Erica’s yelling or she’s raising her voice.”—I’m very sensitive to that. Like, “Hey can we just not, can we not yell?” And sometimes I don’t even know that I’m raising my voice and I’m yelling as well, and she’s like, “Hey, you need to calm down.” And I’m like, “I am calm!” And then I’m like, “Oh, I’m not calm, I’m yelling.” [laughs]

Myrtle: It’s almost like a little trigger, huh?

Martin: Yeah, oh I hate it, I hate it. The yelling triggers me a lot, a lot. And I mean, I’m not saying I’m not guilty of it myself, but yeah. But and vice versa, like I mentioned earlier, I’m sensitive to the yelling but I’m almost overcompensating with the silence where I kind of store it all up inside and I don’t really say anything. So, it’s hard for Erica even if she’s yelling or not yelling to kind of understand what I’m going through if I’m not saying anything, so it’s kind of like a Catch-22. [laughs]

Myrtle: Well, it sounds like you’re both kind of on the way to understanding how you each deal with, you know, issues and misunderstandings and conflict. And that’s at least, you know, a good basis to start developing your understanding.

And at this point in our discussion, let’s bring back Brother Felmar Serreno, a minister of the gospel in the Church Of Christ. Hi again, Brother Felmar, how are you doing today?

Brother Felmar Serreno: I’m doing well, Sister Myrtle. Hello to you, hello to Brother Martin and Sister Erica, and to everyone who’s tuning in again, here with us on Happy Life.

Myrtle: As you’ve heard, Brother Felmar, today, Erica and Martin have been sharing, you know, how they’ve handled some of their disagreements in marriage. What advice can we take with us today, based on the Bible, when it comes to handling disagreements?

Brother Felmar: Well, may I first start by saying that if anyone listening right now is feeling anxious, because maybe an argument between you and your spouse has happened recently, we pray that the Lord God may help you right now to be calm, and open to receiving guidance.

Disagreements in marriage are normal—they do happen. After all, we are NOT perfect beings; there is a limit to what we know at present, and there is a limit to what we can foresee. Note, too, that as individuals we have different upbringings; different individual qualities. But while disagreements are to be expected in marriage, what Bible-based principle should be remembered when they arise? Allow me to read for you what can be found in the Book of Ephesians, chapter 5, verses 28 to 29, in the Good News Bible:

“…A man who loves his wife loves himself. None of us ever hate our own bodies. Instead, we feed them, and take care of them, just as Christ does the church;” [Ephesians 5:28-29 Good News Bible]

Brother Felmar: The Bible is clear, “A man who loves his wife loves himself. None of us ever hate our own bodies.” What can we learn from this? Treat your spouse the way you want to be treated. Don’t treat your spouse the way you don’t want to be treated.

So to the newlyweds listening, the next time a disagreement might occur between you and your spouse—for it not to escalate, please consider the following: If you don’t like being interrupted or cut off while you’re trying to express yourself, don’t do it to your spouse. If you don’t like feeling insulted; spoken to sarcastically or condescendingly, don’t do it to your spouse.

If you like being given a moment to collect your thoughts and calm your emotions before continuing a discussion, so why not do that for your spouse. If you like being listened to when you’re explaining your side, so do the same to your spouse; listen well when he or she is speaking.

Let’s move on to another point. According to many research studies, some of the leading causes for disagreements and problems in marriage are: money, in-laws, differences on matters of religion (or level of faith) and even opposing preferences in spending leisure time. However, what must we also stop to consider when there is distress or lack of peace? In the Book of Deuteronomy, chapter 31, verse 17 in the New International Version, the Bible reveals to us this:

“And in that day I will become angry with them and forsake them; I will hide my face from them, and they will be destroyed. Many disasters and calamities will come on them, and in that day they will ask, ‘Have not these disasters come on us because our God is not with us?’”

[Deuteronomy 31:17 New International Version]

Brother Felmar: According to the verse we read, when disasters would come upon God’s people, God said they would ask, “Have not these disasters come on us because our God is not with us?” So that’s what married couples should reflect on. Have disasters come into their life because God is not with them?

Now this obviously is very bad news for a married couple. Upon reflecting, we realize that God is not present in our marriage. And why is that? Because according to the Bible (and we’ve studied this in our previous podcasts), it is God who joins husband and wife in holy matrimony. It is by God’s laws and commandments that husband and wife are bound to each other in marriage. Therefore, a married couple should be benefiting from God’s companionship in their married life.

However, here we are hearing that it is possible for God to distance Himself from us—but why would God do that? When would He do that? What would prompt the Lord God to end up distancing Himself from His people?—even from a married couple that He had joined together? Let’s find out the answer here in the Book of Isaiah, chapter 59, verse 2, in the New King James Version we can read:

“But your iniquities have separated you from your God; And your sins have hidden His face from you, So that He will not hear.”

[Isaiah 59:2 New King James Version]

Brother Felmar: So, iniquity or sin is the leading cause for lack of God’s presence in our life (or none at all). In married life, this can only lead to things like recurring disagreements, tensions, and heartbreak. Which is why we must not commit sins like adultery; or giving into things like drugs or drinking alcohol, or any other kind of vice. For how can we expect God’s love, peace, and blessings to enter our marriage, if we will allow wickedness to enter instead?

So just in case there’s a husband or wife listening to this right now who may be asking, “How then can we have God back in our life and harmony back

in our marriage?”

Listen please to what we can read in the Book of Malachi, chapter 3, verse 7, in the Christian Community Bible, God says:

“Since the day of your ancestors you stray from my ordinances and do not practice them. Return to me and I will return to you, says [the LORD] of hosts. …”

[Malachi 3:7 Christian Community Bible]

Brother Felmar: Which is why in the Church Of Christ that we are members of, we are taught from the Holy Scriptures that if we have committed sins and mistakes, we should repent, renew our life and return to God. And for so long as a married couple retains God in their life, all disagreements will be resolved, without compromising the harmony between husband and wife.

Myrtle: As always, Brother Felmar, we thank you for sharing those words from the Bible with all of us.

Brother Felmar: Thank you as well to you Sister Myrtle. More power to the Happy Life team, and God bless always to the married couples.

[22:47 – BREAK]
Before we get back to our newlyweds, I just wanted to mention that Martin is the host of Heart and Soul. It’s another podcast produced by INCMedia. So make sure you check that out and other podcasts like The God’s Message Podcast and the Faith and Family podcast.

Myrtle: Alright, so back to our guests, Martin and Erica, how much of an impact does having the same faith as members of the Church Of Christ have on your relationship? Does it help in any way when there are disagreements?

Erica: It’s a huge impact. You know, in those times of disagreements, you look at each other and then you realize, hey, this is…you have to remember that this is God’s blessing. Treat it like it’s your blessing. Show God that, you know, this relationship is worthy of His love, worthy of His blessings. And you base your relationship off of your faith in the Church Of Christ. Through those times, I can remember, you know, Martin reminding me that in (being) long-distance that we’ve got this, because God’s got us. We have our prayers, we’re very prayerful. We had our devotional prayers and, as goals and aspirations as a couple, we wanted to get married—we wanted to have a ‘happy life’ together. Look at that.

Myrtle: [laughs]

Erica: And, because we’re members of the Church Of Christ, we truly believe in our prayers, and with time, we truly see that God’s blessings showered. He really does guide your plans.

Myrtle: So Martin how does, you know, prayer, kind of, shape how you handle being a husband in the relationship?

Martin: You know, like, just to speak to what Erica was saying, we met each other at Washington, DC on a chance encounter during rehearsals for C3, for the….

Myrtle: Yes, you guys had the best hashtag for your wedding.

Erica and Martin: [laughs]

Myrtle: From C3 to eternity!

Martin: C3 to eternity. You think about that, like, oh a guy from Toronto, a girl from Atlanta. They met in Washington, DC for a huge Church event. And then, you know, age gap, long distance—there’s no way that’s going to work out.

And when you’re a member of the Church Of Christ, it’s all the more possible because those plans—however impossible it might seem to the world—is guided by God. And we’re proof of that, and we’re thankful for that, and it’s something that we include in our prayer every single day, to cherish this seemingly impossible relationship that blossomed out of faith and prayer.

Myrtle: For sure, yeah. I’m a product of a long distance relationship myself, so-

Martin: Right?

Myrtle: –I absolutely know where you’re coming from.

Martin: And you guys used letters. Like, what is instant messaging?

Myrtle: What was a jpeg, you know?

Erica: [laughs]

Myrtle: We had to mail photos—that we had to print—to each other. Okay, now I’m aging myself.

Martin: [laughs].

Myrtle: Let’s move on. [laughs]

Erica: [laughs]

Myrtle: So Erica, you did mention that with this pandemic, you’ve experienced some loss too with family. What do you pray for now, in terms of how this pandemic has affected you and your marriage?

Erica: You know especially, yeah, with the pandemic, you realize that life’s too short and that, you know, we pray in our devotional prayers that God will take care of all of us and keep us healthy and safe, and all of our loved ones and friends, that everyone’s going to be okay. That God’s plan will you know pan out and that He will always keep us all safe but bless us especially in our duties so that all of us can be united in one faith, so that we’ll all be together in the end.

Myrtle: Absolutely. So why don’t we finish up our discussion today with this question: “When it comes to disagreements, what are you both still working on in your marriage?”

Martin: I think we’re at this stage now of being as goal-oriented as we can be. Right now, knowing the pandemic has hurt a lot of people, like Erica said everybody, everybody is suffering.

Myrtle: Yes.

Martin: And right now we’re in a position where we’re very, very blessed. We’re very, very taken care of in every aspect of our marriage at this point. And so really, our goal isn’t so much like ‘what are we trying to figure out that you know, that we’re fighting over.’ Our goal is how do we share as much of the blessings that we’ve received to our, to the immediate ones that need it the most in our life. With God’s help together, as a married couple, how can we help spread the blessings and share what we have with the ones who aren’t as fortunate right now.

Myrtle: For sure, yeah. So it was so great to talk to you both today.

Erica: Thank you so much for having us in your podcast. You’ve opened up a conversation that we don’t usually have on a regular basis, but appreciating each other you need to have those times too.

Myrtle:  We thank you for sharing that, because you know what you really have to hold onto is each other, and your love for each other, and the blessing that God did give you through marriage.

So, we heard how Martin & Erica have learned to deal with little conflicts in their marriage. And most of all, we heard God’s words and advice through the Bible. We hope that all of this information will help every married couple to get over any tough spots when it comes to handling disagreements between husband and wife.

Now, for our next episode we have a topic that falls under the ‘inadequate attention’ category. What do you do when your spouse has tuned out and they’re physically there but maybe mentally somewhere else? We’ll be delving into that interesting topic next time, so make sure that you tune in!

And that’s all we have for you today. To learn more about Christian relationships please visit www.incmedia.org. If you have any questions or just want to send us a message, email us at info@incmedia.org with the subject Happy Life.

Thank you from all of us here on the Happy Life team. We’re so glad you joined us today, and hope we’ve all been reminded about the blessing of marriage.

[Show closes]

HAPPY LIFE PODCAST

Season 1, Episode 4 –

Communication in Marriage: Decision Making

[Show opens]

Sis. Myrtle Alegado (Host): When your alarm goes off, you wake up and think about whether or not you should press that snooze button, right? Multiple times, every day, we make decisions. They could be small or inconsequential, and then there are those major ones that could be life-changing.

On the website www.goroberts.edu, it states that an adult makes about 35,000 remotely conscious decisions each day. And as surprising as it may sound, as a matter of fact, we make 226.7 decisions each day on just food alone, according to researchers at Cornell University. For me, I start my day by choosing between maybe a coffee or cappuccino, and whether or not I’ll have toast or cereal, or if I’m actually going to eat breakfast at all.

Now, those are just some examples of the small decisions we make on our own. What about when we get married and have to make decisions with our spouse— especially big decisions? Could it be that much different? How should married couples go about making decisions?

Welcome to Happy Life, the newest podcast brought to you by INCMedia that helps newlyweds navigate through the first months of marriage. I’m Myrtle Alegado and I’ve been married to my husband, Paul, since May of 1999.

[Catchphrase]

Inspiration to make your marriage thrive, you’re listening to Happy Life.

Myrtle: According to www.tonyrobbins.com, in an article contributed by David Hilton of Life Marriage Retreats: In a relationship, the number of decisions we make on our own may decrease significantly, not because every decision must be made together, but we now consider the impact of our choices on the other person. Now, why is it so important that we give great care to the choices we make as a married couple?

In an article “Decision-Making In Marriage” written by Dr. David Isaacs on www.familylifeinstitutes.org, it is usually said that bad decision-making is one of the leading causes of problems in matrimony. As part of our ‘Effective Communication in Marriage’ series, in this episode we’ll learn about decision-making as a newlywed couple.

And to share with us their experiences as a married couple for three years now, here with us today from Calgary, Alberta, Canada are Patrick and Zandrhea De Guzman. Welcome to Happy Life, Patrick and Zandrhea! How are you both today?

Zandrhea De Guzman: Hi everyone! It’s so great to be here.

Patrick De Guzman: Hey, we’re doing good!

Myrtle: Good to hear! We’re happy to have you here. So, it’s normal and common for newlyweds to face a lot of firsts, new beginnings, different opportunities, and big decisions as a couple. So, Pat and Zandy, can you share with us some examples of major decisions you’ve made together, and how you went about them?

Patrick: Sure, I could start with our wedding. I guess that probably was our first big decision that we had to make. Knowing that we wanted to pay for our wedding ourselves, you know, we had to make cuts, right? And so, some of the things we were considering were how many people could we invite, what is our budget. As grand of a wedding we wanted, we also wanted to make sure that it’s within our budget. So, I want to say, yeah, maybe the wedding planning alone. Also, really, where do we choose where to live?

Zandrhea: Definitely, yeah. That was one of the big ones. I mean, I guess from my end, both of us, we’re both working so it would be possibly our careers, what we want to do in life—if that affects either of us—what we think of, our dreams, our aspirations when it comes to our careers. So that’s… Yeah, those were big ones for us.

Myrtle: Can you share with us what your careers are currently?

Zandrhea: I’m currently a legal assistant at a law firm.

Patrick: And I’m a multimedia developer.

Myrtle: And then you’re juggling your careers and trying to adjust to married life. And do you also have hobbies on the side?

Zandrhea: Yes, I like to take photos. So I guess you would say I’m sort of an amateur photographer. So, I kind of chase that when I’m not working. 

Myrtle: That’s awesome.

Patrick: I feel like there’s no shortage of hobbies. I’ve recently gotten into filmmaking before that. I’m still doing it. I like to paint. Yeah, so there’s a lot of stuff there, and I guess Zan just picked up a…I guess she’s a plant lady now? I don’t know.

Zandrhea: Oh yes.

Myrtle: [laughs]

Zandrhea: Now I’m also a mother of plants. [laughs]

Myrtle: All of those things factor into deciding, right, how you’re going to juggle, how are you going to make time for everything. And then, you mentioned deciding where to live. Did you have that discussion before you got married, and how did you come to a decision on that?

Patrick and Zandrhea: [laughs]

Patrick: There’s a lot there. Because the thing for me is I’m very logical in a sense, and Zan is a…

Zandrhea: I’m a free spirit. [laughs]

Myrtle: [laughs]

Patrick: There we go. That’s a good way to put it. On the moving part, that one’s kind of interesting. So, I like to stay in one place. Zan doesn’t. Well, that’s not true.

Zandrhea: No.

Patrick: She likes different things.

Zandrhea: I like experiencing different areas of the city, apparently. [laughs]

Myrtle: [laughs]

Patrick: Right. Obviously, after our wedding, one of the bigger questions that we had was, you know, ‘where would we live?’ Initially, we lived downtown, and that’s primarily because that’s where we worked and that’s where, I guess, everything is. Within like first two, three years, we probably moved three times.

Myrtle: Oh wow.

Patrick: It was fun.

Zandrhea: Was it three times? I think it was two.

Patrick: I want to say four, but I’ll give you a discount.

Zandrhea: [laughs]

Myrtle: [laughs]

Zandrhea: Okay, three times, whatever. It’s fine. [laughs] Yeah, and you know what though? With that, I feel like it was hard for me to convince Patrick when I wanted to move, only because when you’re a newlywed, you don’t really know what you want in terms of space. And again, with the whole budgeting thing, we’re like, let’s maybe live downtown but go to a place that we can afford. With… when we’re newlyweds, because we’re learning how, I guess, to split our budgets, and how much space do we really need? We didn’t really know that at first. We just thought, ‘Oh this is a great location. It’s within our budget. Let’s go here.’ But, within, I think, within six months I was like, “We bought way too much stuff and I think we’re going to need to move.” So…

Myrtle: And you needed a bigger space already? [laughs]

Zandrhea: Apparently. Well, I mean, I think if you go from a 550-square foot house or a condo, and there’s two of you, and one of them likes to paint—and I’m not blaming that on you. [laughs]

Patrick: You know, I’ll take it. It’s fine.

Zandrhea: It was a lot of our stuff that we accumulated in our first year of marriage. It was kind of, we outgrew it really quickly. So, yeah…

Myrtle: So, you obviously convinced him somehow, because you said you did move. So, how did that discussion go and, you know, what did you do to convince Patrick that it was a good decision for you both?

Zandrhea: Maybe I’ll talk about our third move? I wanted to live near my parents, my family. I have a small family, so they would occasionally come visit us and it was too far for them at times because of church. We would only see each other on church days, so I thought it would probably be best to be in the neighborhood closest to my family. So, I had to really convince him. Aside from the fact that, you know, of course we’ll be near our family and we’ll be able to see them more often, I had to be more specific in the reasons why I thought that it was a good decision. As Pat mentioned, he’s a logical thinker, so he’s the type of person who likes to see what you mean by ‘this is a good decision.’ So, I just made it seem that we were saving money and we would spend less on gas. I made a…I guess I’ll let Pat talk about that. [laughs]

Patrick: Okay, so here: Is it further away from work? Yes. Did we save money? Actually, no. But for some reason we’re happier and, I mean, I’ll take that over anything else. Like she said, we’re closer to her family. If they need something, we can be there and vice versa.

So, this is how she really convinced me. I like numbers, and so she decided to put together, I think it was an Excel spreadsheet with literally everything from, ‘hey, this is how big our tank is, this is how far our travel is everyday, this is how much gas is between now and I don’t know when.’ And so, I looked at it and I just said I was really impressed. So I [said], “You know what, let’s consider it.”

But the funny thing is, we saved money because of the errors in her calculations. Most of her calculations were based off of kilometers, with exception to maybe one number, which was in miles per hour. And, at this point I just said yes, because she actually tried and that’s good enough for me.

Myrtle: Hey, it sounded like it, yeah.

Zandrhea: [laughs]

Myrtle:  No, you put a spreadsheet together. That’s impressive to try and convince your spouse, you know, that these are the reasons that I think it would be a good idea. And numbers speak volumes sometimes, right? So, hey, A for effort, Zan!

Zandrhea: [laughs]

Myrtle: But you know, it really is nicer to live closer to your families, especially in the beginning, because you have that support system, right—especially when you’re still adjusting. But now, you’re in your third year of marriage. Are there any methods that you follow in making your decisions together?

Patrick: So generally, I mean, we decide everything together. You know, there are smaller decisions that we kind of make, that really doesn’t affect, I guess, money, or anything that’s permanent. And so, those things we do independently. But, for the most part, I’ll look at finances. I don’t know why. I find comfort in numbers, it’s like a blanket.

Zandrhea: [laughs]

Patrick: [laughs] And so, I look after finances and tech. I just, I Iove research. I want to make sure when we invest or purchase something, it actually lasts. On the other hand, Zan takes care of us actually, you know, staying alive.

Zandrhea: [laughs]

Myrtle: [laughs]

Patrick: What I mean by that is, you know, all the things that are actually essential, like food, are we.. you know, the things that matter. I just, I take care of the other side of that stuff. Yeah, I don’t know, I mean, we make decisions together.

Myrtle: That makes sense if you’re going to play to each other’s strengths especially if you’re a numbers person and Zandy doesn’t want to touch it, that’s fine, right? So, you also said that you collectively decide on things together, but you also kind of pinpoint your strengths.

Zandrhea: I’m an extrovert, Pat’s an introvert. I feel like understanding how he handles situations and why his mind goes there, to decide certain things individually for him. And, I like to do things on a whim. I like to be, like “Oh, I’m just going to just do this,” and if it’s something not as important, like buying clothes or something, or something for the house,-

Myrtle: [laughs]

Zandrhea: -I’ll be like, “You know what, it’s a good week. We’re going to do this,” but I’ve definitely learned a lot more about making proper decisions, especially thinking long-term because, you know, my decisions aren’t my own when it comes to life planning, I guess. Me and Pat, we definitely are more on the same page now after a couple of years of, just like, being patient, I guess.

Patrick: I think we’re on the same book.

Zandrhea: Oh. [laughs]

Myrtle: [laughs]

Patrick: Slightly different pages. You know what, we make it work.

Zandrhea: [laughs]

Myrtle: So, how do you both get to a point where you know that you’ve made the right decision, or that you feel like, you know, that you’re making the right choices together?

Patrick: I think the right decision doesn’t necessarily serve either one of us specifically. You know, like, when we think of what’s the correct thing to do, it’s more about, again, long-term. If we do this, will this benefit us in the future? Again, whether or not that was my idea or Zan’s idea, I think it doesn’t matter to either of us, you know. We just want to make sure that we come up with the correct decision. We’ve also learned to be really, just open. We talk about things now. When we were first dating, I…I’m like a shell. I keep things to myself. Pretty much one thing we’ve done after we got married is we communicate more.

Zandrhea: I think in the beginning, I was over-communicating and Pat was like, “I just want to think about it”, you know? “Let’s just, like maybe we’ll put this aside for now and we’ll talk about it when I’m done.”

Myrtle: So, he tables things and you’re like, “Let’s go. Let’s talk about it.” [laughs]

Zandrhea: Yeah, I’m like, “We need to decide now,” and he’s like making charts in his head.

Myrtle: [laughs]

Zandrhea: Numbers guy, right? So, now, I’ll give him his space. When it’s a big decision and you know, it’s something that we have to really need to think about, I’ve definitely learned how to kind of give him that chance to think about it first before he comes up with his, like what he wants me to understand, that kind of thing. I guess for myself, I just assume everyone just thinks the same way that I do. Maybe that’s just, that’s most people right? Just read my mind. But, you know, no one’s a mind reader.

Myrtle: For sure, yes.

Zandrhea: You definitely have to, like, be specific on what your thoughts are. Even now, yeah we’re in our third year of marriage, sometimes I still have times when I struggle with saying how I feel, but it’s definitely a work in progress and Pat’s been really patient with all the words that I need to tell him, like, ASAP. [laughs]

Myrtle: Well I definitely think that a lot of couples struggle with communicating, you know, how they feel and where their minds are at with decision-making and trying to get their spouse on board.

[Music starts]

Myrtle: To give us a deeper understanding and guidance of what the Bible says on how married couples should go about making decisions, let’s welcome a minister of the gospel in the Church Of Christ, Brother Felmar Serreno. Hi, Brother Felmar, and welcome back to Happy Life!

Brother Felmar Serreno: Hello, Sister Myrtle. Here we are again on Happy Life, the fourth episode now, if I’m not mistaken?

Myrtle: Yes!

Brother Felmar: And we have Brother Pat and Sister Zandrhea with us. Again, thank you for joining us, and for sharing with us your experiences and what you’ve learned through your three years of marriage so far. And, I’m sure many newlyweds tuning in at this moment can relate to what you’ve experienced.

You know, in this part of our podcast, we’d like to direct everyone’s attention to this aspect of marriage that will be presented to us by the Holy Scriptures. What is a teaching from the Bible which husband and wife should remember when making decisions? Here in the Book of Ephesians, chapter 5, the verses are 33 and 22 from the Good News Bible:

But it also applies to you: every husband must love his wife as himself, and every wife must respect her husband…Wives, submit yourselves to your husbands as to the Lord.

[Ephesians 5:33, 22 Good News Bible]

Brother Felmar: Here, we are reminded about an aspect of marriage as designed by God— that the husband is the head or leader of the relationship. Therefore, when making decisions together, as a married couple, there should be no ‘power struggle’.

Can husband and wife talk it out; deliberate the matter at hand before rendering a decision? Absolutely! Should such discussions turn into frequent arguing and a struggle for power? Absolutely not! For example, if it is due to the wife not respecting her husband’s authority as the head of the relationship.

But note to the husbands: God has appointed us as the leader in the relationship, so let’s be a good leader. As the Bible said earlier, “Every husband must love his wife.” And based on 1 Corinthians, chapter 13, verse 4 from the New International Version, “Love is patient, love is kind.”

So, husbands, let’s be patient. Let’s listen well and give our undivided attention to our wife when she’s expressing her opinion. Let’s be kind to our wife; be considerate and value her suggestions and insight.

When both sides have been heard on a particular matter, then it is the responsibility of the husband to take the lead in rendering the decision and it is the responsibility of the wife to support said decision.

When we follow God’s design in marriage, there will never be a struggle for power. Rather, peace and harmony will be maintained.

More importantly, what must husband and wife remember before making decisions, especially on matters that will have a big impact on our life and our future? In the Book of Proverbs chapter 3, verses 5 down to 6:

Trust in the LORD with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding; In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall direct your paths.

[Proverbs 3:5-6 New King James Version]

Brother Felmar: In all our ways, in the decisions we make in life, let us not rely on our own understanding. Instead, let us trust in God. That’s why being prayerful is important. And praises be to God, many married couples in the Church Of Christ are doing this, like Brother Patrick and Sister Zandrhea. By establishing devotional prayer, married couples are praying together on a daily basis. Now, just in case some newlyweds out there who are listening in are not doing this yet—establishing a devotional prayer and fulfilling it regularly—may this next Bible verse inspire you to do so.

Why be prayerful? Why should we always remember to acknowledge God and seek His guidance? Listen, please, to Jeremiah, chapter 29, verse 11 in the Good News Bible:

I alone know the plans I have for you, plans to bring you prosperity and not disaster, plans to bring about the future you hope for.

[Jeremiah 29:11 Good News Bible]

Brother Felmar: What we read here is the declaration of the Lord God Himself. According to His pronouncement, He is the One, first and foremost, Who wants to give us prosperity and a future. And let’s not forget, the Almighty God is the only One Who has the ability to give us a blessed future. So in all our decisions, may we always include God, consult Him through His words written in the Bible, and trust in Him.

[Music starts]

Myrtle: Once again, Brother Felmar, we thank you so much for these words, these reminders and teachings, from the Bible.

Brother Felmar: Thank you again for having me on Happy Life. God bless to all.

[Music ends]

Myrtle: So, you know, Patrick and Zandy, we heard about being prayerful. Can you share how prayer factors into your marriage?

Patrick: For sure. Devotional prayers are very personal, at least to me. Maybe, one of the things that changed when we got married is that we needed to start praying together. It stops being about what I want, what she wants. It’s really more about what we need together. And so, I think couples should pray together, and really, that’s just how you show that you are one in front of God, right?

I guess, maybe more recently, some of the things that we’ve been praying for is just how blessed we are. We know that, we know the situation of the world but, I mean, here we are—we’re healthy, we have jobs, our families are still well. Wherever they are, they’re healthy as well. We get to go to church together. I don’t know, maybe someday, we still pray about just the idea of having small copies of ourselves running around.

Myrtle: Ooh, a mini Patrick or a mini Zandrhea? [laughs]

Patrick: You know what? I think they’re mainly going to look like her, but nonetheless, still it’s one of the things that we look forward to.

Myrtle: When you disagree on something, Zandrhea, what do you pray for then?

Zandrhea: For me, I definitely pray and seek for God’s guidance. I guess it’s my personality to just want to talk about things right away. I’ve definitely, those moments when I feel so frustrated or I don’t understand—just to go alone and pray, and pray for guidance and pray for patience. I definitely ask for His help, because by myself I can’t. I feel like I need to understand and I need God to show me that, and I need Him to help me. And so, when I ask for that I feel like it’s been the reason why me and Patrick have been doing well. We’re able to communicate more. That’s another thing that I pray for: that we can communicate and we can talk about these decisions and these plans that we have for ourselves, because without God’s guidance, our plans are really nothing, right?

Myrtle: MMhmm.Well, it sounds like you do keep that communication open between yourselves and that’s really, really wonderful to hear. But, are there some examples, maybe, that you can share? You know, times when you didn’t see eye to eye on things? Do you have some little snippets of those occasions?

Patrick: I guess the odd thing is we sometimes like to pretend fight, and then it just becomes a real fight. Some examples of disagreements that we had is, well initially the moving was one big one. Sometimes we have conflicts on work. Sometimes, we want to take vacations and it’s just unfortunate that sometimes, for me, I have to take work with me. And so, you know, that’s not something that, obviously, I should be taking with me, but just the circumstances call for it.

Myrtle: Right.

Patrick: You know? But I think one of the most important things that we’ve stated, even when we were starting to just date or I guess courtship, when we were starting that, we never wanted to argue with emotions. And, what I mean by that is we want to make sure that when we talk about things, it’s about the problem, it’s about the disagreement. I feel like when you bring emotions  in, we stop talking about what really matters.

Zandrhea: You know, we really try not to hold it against each other if we don’t see eye to eye. Because sometimes, for myself as an extrovert, I can get really worked up, but Pat really kind of grounds me when it comes to reeling me in to just saying like, “Hey, let’s really talk about this. Let’s not make this an emotional fight.” This is just something we need to just talk about and point out parts of where our opinions are. It’s really helped us to really understand each other and why the person feels that way. You know, I learned from Pat that not all problems are actually problems.

Patrick: Isn’t that nice?

Myrtle: [laughs]

Zandrhea: Really it is, because I’ll be like, “Oh no, I can’t go on,” you know, just dramatic. Because I used to just freeze when a problem would come up, but he’s really just kind of allowed me to look at it in a different perspective. And you know, if we have the same goal in solving this issue, it’ll be easier for us to resolve the disagreement.

Myrtle: That’s a great outlook, you know, to have when it comes to not seeing eye to eye on things.

[Music starts]

Myrtle: Disagreements can be difficult to avoid at times amongst married couples, and communication plays a big part on this, which is why we invite all of you to tune in to our next episode where we will focus on disagreements in our ‘Effective Communication in Marriage’ series.

To our guests, Patrick and Zandrhea, we thank you so much for being part of this episode of Happy Life!

Patrick: Thanks for having us!

Zandrhea: Thank you so much for having us. We had fun.

Myrtle: Oh, I’m so glad. [laughs]

And, that wraps up our discussion today. Please continue to share our podcast with all the newly married couples out there and also visit www.incmedia.org to learn more about Christian relationships.

You can email us at info@incmedia.org with the subject Happy Life if you want to send us a quick question or even just say hello.

Thank you from all of us here on the Happy Life team. We’re so glad you joined us today, and God bless all the married couples.

[Music ends]

[Show closes]